I was enjoying Spiritual Arsons recent podcast, episode “Seething with symbolism,” with special guest Leiland Tanner. I want to say this episode is probably one of my favorites so far; go ahead and listen to it then come back to Spiritual Danger Close (SDC). Adam along with Tanner, asked some great questions, to which I also agree that the episode could have easily been Peter Jackson Directors Cut long. The episode alone has so many tangents you can chase down during your personal devotional. It got me on a tangent as well, and thinking about some of the symbolism in my life, the things that I experienced, the symbols I support, the symbols I bring into my life, the symbols I try to learn, etc. What means one thing can mean something else entirely. Or in language how you say it, the context can change entirely.
Symbology is crucial in understanding the world, as well personal as we are growing in the gospel. I agree with Leiland’s sentiment that it’s necessary for our eternal salvation to be understanding, as well being wary of the symbols in the world around. Especially the symbols we choose to ingest or bring into our lives daily. I wanted to reach out to Leiland Tanner myself to see if he would be willing to carry on a little bit of a similar yet different conversation. If you missed the podcast Spiritual Arson, or also don’t know who Leiland is that’s alright; SDC will catch you up. Leiland’s SoundCloud can be found here, https://soundcloud.com/leiland, he has built an impressive library of 101 tracks.
Questions and Answers.
I admit that I have messed around on music making, for my personal Instagram I got tired of my videos being pulled to copy right for 20 seconds of a song in the background. I downloaded some apps to make my own music, I also have at times dabbled on my personal computer with software trials for music making. I haven’t really had a desire to keep making anything more, I just don’t have the time as well I’m a little tone deaf. Q. When you started this adventure did you know what you were getting into? For example, did you know everything you needed to make professional quality music, or did you by happen chance find out after the fact.
A. No, I had no clue what I was doing when I started, I was only 15 or 16 years old, if that. I actually hated rap music but was forced to listen to it in High School a lot. For a time, the local hip hop radio station would come to our school once a week and host a freestyle battle for prizes during the lunch hour. I was making fun of how bad they were all rhyming and improvising -when I was challenged by my friends to go battle, so I did it as a joke and I was always up for a challenge and an opportunity to prove myself. I found out I had a natural talent for it and won and made a lot of friends with people that I probably normally wouldn’t have hung out with. After that – I started recording music and tracks at home just for fun and it evolved wildly from there. /
Q. What equipment did you start with at song 001, and what do you have now at track 101?
A. I made my first beat and song on a $20 Magix Music Maker program on a Windows 98 PC and with a generic computer microphone. It was bad – you can hear some of those old songs if you go way back through my tracks on SoundCloud, some of the oldest ones I made when I was in High School in the early 2000’s. Now at tracks 100+, I’m still using the equipment I upgraded to when I got married back in 2007, with the exception of maybe my Digital Audio Workstation (DAW). I currently use FL Studio 12, a MXL 990 Microphone, a generic PreSonus Audiobox USB interface and a VERY flimsy M-Audio Keystation. With that – I am able to do everything you hear me do. I am in desperate need of a computer & software and Keyboard upgrade soon, it’s been a while – and I think I could take things to another level if I bear down and invest in some more professional gear. Future goals. /
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There are a couple remixes out there, such as Kolobyte’s (https://soundcloud.com/kolobyte) track Leiland Tanner – Let It Be known (Kolobyte Peculiar Mix). Q. Have other members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day saints reached out to you for advice on getting into music?
A. Yes, I have had a few fellow member musicians and producers reach out for advice – but a fairly small sample size to be honest. More in this last year – and that has been really exciting to me, I’ve heard some other rappers especially who are taking a queue from my style and tone and making their own groove and I love it. I’m excited to see how the Millennium music-scene will unfold once the Babylonian tower records collapse. It’s a bout 20+ years late, but I am impatient. /
Q. For those who have reached out, or those who have yet to reach out, that are interested into getting into music. What is the bare minimum that they would need to explore music making?
A. A desire to create and to immerse yourself in learning how to do it – then go for it. You can have the most amazing equipment in the world, but if your heart isn’t 100% checked-in – all that doesn’t matter. Also – approach your talents and sharing them in the same way you should approach your Gospel learning, line upon line, precept upon precept, here a little, there a little. Set goals and do work! /
Q. Is there a blessing that you have been cognizant of, that you knew came because of your pursuit in making peculiar music?
A. Absolutely and too many to detail. For one, the happiness I can produce intrinsically by using my creative talents in a constructive way is ‘on-command’ now. I can access my music and memories and feelings and a mind-state associated with it at any time now – whether passively through my 100+ finished tracks or through sitting down daily or weekly to let my talent work actively. I feel the Savior’s love when I am immersed and consecrated in composing, writing and recording a song centered on the Gospel. Everyone should have a creative talent and outlet that they can access like I do my music, it has saved my life and helped me escape deep pits of despair too many times to count. Secondly, I share my music and others resonate and benefit from it – to me this is like a micro-fulfillment of the two great commandments and a powerful testimony to me of why I should never fear or stop bearing my talents. I’ve also had countless missionary experiences through my music – they are a constant net that I have out to catch the souls of those seeking the Lord and also seeking good music that they can feel and connect with. I love my music and my talents for those opportunities. There are many other blessings that I derive from my efforts to make peculiar music – I testify that we should seek to enhance and to use our talents to further the Lord’s work. He expects us to. /
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I have had a wild journey in my faith I can often relate to Alma, Paul, and the prodigal son, in the scriptures. At the time I was heavily into Deathcore, and several of shoots of that genre. At work I would play it low volume at my computer, most people can’t understand the lyrics in guttural vocals so I figures nobody would mind. I hadn’t really noticed that anyone paid attention, aside from a few comments that I was into some hard music.
During a break we were talking about what we were doing, and I mentioned since I started going back to church, I was going to go hang out with our Young Single Adults group. To which a coworker was utterly shocked at, “I thought you were an atheist?!” I realized at the time that music has a profound effect on us, and the way people perceive us. Q. What advice do you have for on figuring out which of Babylon’s music is alright, and which to avoid?
A. We often justify the music we listen to by choosing to ignore the lyrics or the moods and places that they take our minds and hearts. I would say – start paying attention to these things and consciously protect yourself. Especially from the lyrics (the spells, the spellings). Start trying to understand the intent and messages of musicians, be awake and alert and on guard. They are at full attack right now and most of us are totally asleep while in the front lines. Live righteously too – the more we write the commandments in our heart, the more aware of what we consume we inevitably become. /
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You said when you entered the missionary training center (MTC), you had a lot of doubts about worthiness. You realized like Joseph Smith Junior you had committed a few youthful follies. I remember when I was the MTC that a few missionaries admitted they were woefully underprepared to serve. Q. Besides the required worthiness, and mission preparation standards, what advice do you have to future missionaries?
A. Do it the right way or don’t do it. Go and give all of your heart, might, mind and strength to God and to your neighbors. Go and EXPECT to have hard trials, to have powerful spiritual manifestations, to eat scary food, to get sick, to be chased by dogs, to be yelled at by everyone, and to grow exponentially in your understanding and love for the Savior and for the Gospel. At no other time in your life will you be able to just FORGET everything Babylonian and for 2 years do hard maintenance and foundational work on your own mind and soul. You are preparing to become a MAN. Your relationships with your companions are training for your eternal companion and how you will treat and honor and work with them. See the end from the beginning. It is not a vacation. It is a coming-of-age ritual and it requires your full attention during the sacrifice. /
Q. For perspective missionary what symbols do you think they need to understand before putting the tag on?
A. The Cornerstone. They will wear it emblematically over their heart as they literally represent the Lord and His Church with a holy calling and mantle. Let that nametag transform you. Let that name [Jesus Christ] that you carry on the outside of your heart be also forever written on the inside of your heart – the cornerstone of your bodily Temple. Another primary symbol is the Sacrament. This is the most important thing you do every week to work out your own Salvation; study these symbols and emblems until you are old, and then, don’t stop. They will keep bringing fruits. Baptism by immersion, the Iron Rod and the Tree of Life. Those are my top 5. You can now with those see any rod, any tree, any body of water, any square, and any food to consume as pathways to draw your mind back to a remembrance of the Lord if you work to associate those symbols with your spiritual understanding of the Gospel. /
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On my mission for my first Christmas out in the mission field. The mission president gifted all 300 plus missionaries’ special gifts. For the sister missionaries he got necklaces, with a pendant of the Nauvoo temples stained glass star; see below Nauvoo Stained Glass Windows. Given our mission was in the bible belt, the mission president proceeded to break down the importance of this symbol. This showed to me that a lot of members are woefully ignorant in terms off understanding our symbology. While I knew of the several meanings behind the pentagram, I will admit I didn’t know its context in terms of our theological paradigm. Q. What symbolism do you think every member of the church should study about and gain an understanding for themselves?
A. All of it. Knowledge truly is power and correctly associating symbols with the appropriate Restored Gospel knowledge creates a powerful tool to in our quest to overcome the carnal and bring every thought unto Christ. My personal focus is always on the Temple of the Lord. I testify that faithfully seeking to understand the symbols of the Temple in greater depth while attending regularly with that intentional purpose has brought me closer to the Lord and to my wife and family and to the Prophet than at any other time in my life. Don’t stop seeking – you can always repent and you can always learn something new here. Do it. /
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I think that every missionary meets some sort of doctrine or part of church history that they are oblivious too. I think a common one is the Masonic Associations with our church in the beginning. One hot southern afternoon a companion and I tracked into a very charismatic Free Mason. We unfortunately wasted out time there, that could have been spent proselyting elsewhere.
During our conversation, and attempted lesson, we both learned a lot about Free Masons, and associated topics. It really didn’t shock me as I’m a history nerd and was already familiar with the Mason’s. I ended up later joining a masonic lodge, to which I haven’t finished as I moved away from. I don’t have the time for it now, and as things have changed, I don’t really have a desire to continue; a blog for another day.
Through that experience I can say that it was necessary for Joseph Smith Junior., along with early church leaders to be masons. That it was a tool used to receive the greater revelations regarding our temple worship. For those curious to study this on your own, please see the official topic from the church’s website (https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/history/masonry). Q. Leiland, do you think members need to study this aspect to understand some symbology we use today?
A. Yes. I believe if you are an intellectually honest person and you are seeking to know all things that have been revealed pertaining to certain symbols and the Temple, you will inevitably find yourself squarely seeking to understand the masonic angle. Do so in faith, and do so with joy, you have the Gift of the Holy Ghost to guide and to teach. I love to discern and to learn by the Spirit. The key is to never stop maintaining the first principles and commandments, always be reading the Canon daily and saying your prayers and striving to magnify your calling. /
Q. Like Joseph Smith, what are some steppingstones that we as members, of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, use to open the door to greater revelation similarly?
A. I’ll defer to President Nelson who spoke plainly about those steppingstones that I have been utilizing with great anxiety and joy in his first conference address titled, “Revelation for the Church, revelation for our lives”. Apart from following the Joseph Smith example of picking sacred spaces and using your whole heart, the Prophet also counsels,
“Nothing opens the heavens quite like the combination of increased purity, exact obedience, earnest seeking, daily feasting on the words of Christ in the Book of Mormon, and regular time committed to temple and family history work.” /
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During your guest appearance on Spiritual Arson you mentioned briefly about the prevalence of symbolism in branding. That companies use symbolism to entice us, to mold the way we think about their products or desire to use their products. From the Doctrine and Covenants we are told repeatedly to be wary of evil and conspiring men. Q. Do you think we can decipher if a new product/company has evil intentions behind it? If so, what are dead giveaway in your opinion to look for?
A. Sure, though I don’t think it is always easily apparent unless they use obvious satanic or profane symbols and/or language – but the spirit of discernment is a powerful bridge when you first exercise all of your own mental energy into honest research. This will require that you accept and are aware of and looking for the tainted global web of secret combinations that have been generally identified by prophets in these latter-days. Identify the ownership and the money behind the company, collect the agendas that you find along the way – with all that good intel and information, the spirit can more powerfully highlight and guide and direct you to connect the pertinent dots or to see the honest fruits for what they are. I do this on a macro-scale with certain geo-political and global-corporate interests that I follow in the name of ‘end-times awareness’, but I admit that I do not vet every single company or product that my family consumes. Near impossible to do so and I know that the Lord is merciful and powerful and I do not fear these secret combinations or their cunning plans to deceive and damage the Children of God. /
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I don’t recall who mentioned it from the Spiritual Arson episode, but I want to bring up shortly McDonalds. I have a special place in my heart for McDonald’s, just typing this I can imagine the savory taste of a McDouble, the fatty beef patties, the salty sweet ketchup, the strong onions, the sour pickle, the sharp American cheese slice, and the pillow like buns. I freely admit that at a time this was my, “I’m Stressed,” go to snack. Then with my wife and I it has a special place as well. Especially, since where she is from McDonald’s is more a special occasion food, and not the everyday restaurant that Americans are used to.
Their branding is cemented in many people’s minds across the world. When shown the Golden arches you have some strong connections. It goes to show you that we should be cognizant of symbols around us. The other day I sat down at my desk at work, and I had a strong craving to eat at a certain restaurant. I’m on a special diet right now so I knew I couldn’t do it. I wondered why I randomly wanted, then I mentioned it out loud to my coworkers. They also agreed that it sounded like a good choice and proceeded to harass me on dietary choices. That’s when I realized that I had been subliminally attacked. My coworker behind him had the restaurant menu pinned to his cubicle wall. While sitting down I had barely even glanced at it, but that’s how profound of an effect it had on me.
Q. How can we better safeguard ourselves against subliminal messaging off a great many symbols around us?
A. You do exactly what you did in that scenario – you become aware that you are being influenced by pausing to ‘think’ about your thoughts and why your emotions have changed. This is a skill and a habit that needs to be actively exercised. Once you’ve gathered an internal SITREP, take an action of your choosing to rectify, don’t let outside influence dictate the decision. Self-awareness is key and easy to improve through repentance, prayer and fasting. /
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Leiland, from your interactions online, and in the Spiritual Arson podcast, you strike me as a fellow that has read the Apocrypha. For those who don’t know the Apocrypha is a collection of other texts that go along with the Old Testament, and some editions/translations of the Holy Bible will include them. When Joseph Smith Junior was correcting the King James Version of the bible, translation he came across the Apocrypha. This led to him receiving the following, “It is not needful that the Apocrypha should be translated” (Doctrine & Covenants 91:3). I personally haven’t read this book; I plan on it one day. At this moment I have it as a low priority to other books on my too read list. Q. Have you read the Apocrypha, if so, what are some basic thoughts?
A. Yes, I have read the KJV Apocrypha as well as many other extra-canonical texts and ancient works. I will defer to the Bible Dictionary definition of ‘Apocrypha’ for the basics – my advice is to seriously seek the Gift and Spirit of Prophecy before you read Apocryphal and Apocalyptic texts. To me in part, that means that I needed to read and become familiar with all prophecy in the Standard Works and to seek to makes sense of them as a unified story/message before I attempted to add supplemental texts to my paradigm. Parts of the Apocrypha fill a number of gaps and add detail to the greater Prophetic picture described by all Prophets from Adam to Nephi to Joseph Smith. I love prophecy. /
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Recently with President Russel M. Nelsons, challenge of #givethanks, which was to go to social media, and use it as gratitude journal. We see that a good bit of people rejected this message. Instantly in the excommunicated community, there were posts to troll and pollute the message by using ridiculousness to negate the meaning. This stood out as an obvious moment, where we can see the adversary working to build stumbling blocks. As well attempting to steal righteous symbols, by outright theft or hindering their impact. Q. Do you think there is any way we can safeguard our symbolism from satanic theft?
A. Not completely, he’s been stealing signs and symbols from the beginning. The best we can do is stand up and let our light so shine. Be a torch on a hill so they can see what we believe and how we interpret the same curious things in the positive and according to the Plan of Salvation.
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On my mission I would encounter what I will call the Hallmark-Mormons (think about the hallmark movies. The couples always seemed to have the best houses, they always smiled, never missed a church service or activity, any plans they had revolved around the church, the pictures were of their family, and there were cliché stenciled phrases on the wall in the modern décor look. I found myself feeling like they were trying so much to have their dwelling be a temple to the Lord that it was cringy. I just felt so uncomfortable being in their homes. I have been pondering about this and will have a blog coming soon about this. I realize in many ways where I was wrong, and that I should aspire to be like them.
We have been commanded to set our houses in order numerous times. Now thinking specifically about the décor of these homes, and the many phrases such as ‘Family Together Forever.’ I have heard some call it tacky, and over sold lifestyle imagery from Deseret Book. I recall that my mission president advised we always have a picture of our assigned temple, and when we pray, we should pray, like unto old, towards the temple of the Lord (We don’t really need to as there are so many temples now. This is also seen still in some Judaism, and in Islam in praying towards the Kaaba in Mecca). Similarly, there are some Christians who in every room of their house have a picture representation of Christ or a Cross as a remind of devotion; I grew up in on home where there were several pictures of Chris throughout the house. Q. My Question Leiland is what the right symbology that we should be bringing into our homes? How much do we bring into our homes?
A. I would say, that is a decision that is between you, your spouse, and the Lord. I take the Temple as the general template, and the temple is full of symbolism. /
Q. Is having an image of Christ necessary to have in a member’s home?
A. Again taking the Temple as the model – absolutely. Not that we worship the image or an idol – but to help bring our mind and attention to Christ and his commandments and blessings. /
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Well this has been fun blog question and answer post. I was able to think about some things, and I hope you were as well. I think as we proactively seek to build back the peculiar culture we will see more of these conversations down the road. I know I don’t have a mindset such as you’re in viewing everything with such a paradigm of symbology, but its good to see where we can improve. Q. Do you have any last words of regarding symbology, or any recommendation on where members can study this more?
A. Symbolism is the universal language. The language of the Universe, of God. Start to learn it for yourself by asking “why?” when it comes to symbols. What do certain symbols represent? Why are certain symbols repeated so often? Do symbols have multiple meanings? What are the original meanings of symbols? Study and attend the Temple as often as you can while you ponder them. Look for as many answers as you possibly can with a wide net of effort – and then trust that the Lord will show you their correct meaning or how they all tie together as you study the scriptures and pray for the gift of understanding. My testimony of Jesus Christ, of the prophet Joseph Smith, of the Book of Mormon, of the Temple, and living prophets today has grown exponentially as I have striven to seek for further light and knowledge about how I can obey Him and bring every thought unto him. I have found an abundance of celestial pearls that bring me great joy and I know that I have but barely scratched the surface. I love the Gospel, and I thank you for this opportunity to share a little piece of my heart. /
Figure 1
Nauvoo Stained Glass Windows
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